TIDE and Hashgacha Pratis

I’m not sure why he says that. It seems pretty clear to me that the Rosh meant universal hashgacha. If you don’t think he meant that, I don’t see how you could read the Ramchal here ( דרך ה', חלק שני, בהשגחה האישיית א׳ | Sefaria Library ) as being anything but universal.

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Sorry was a bit tired , I meant the evidence for the idea that HKBH doesn’t send us trials and tribulations which we can’t handle

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Hashgacha Pratis assigns the ‘Derech Eretz’ our unique environment and challenges as a Divinely appointed stage. We fulfill our mission by sanctifying these earthly conditions through the eternal lens of Torah. Rav Hirsch defines every circumstance as a divine ‘task’ (Aufgabe) Hashem arranges our specific life settings success or trial as the precise tools required to fulfill our unique spiritual duty

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https://library.oapen.org/bitstream/handle/20.500.12657/28249/1001728.pdf?sequence=1&isAllowed=y

https://www.igdj-hh.de/upload/ruerup_ehrensache.pdf

I would like to share 2 links that helped me

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“SEE THE LETTER: HaGaon Rav Dov Landau shlit"a, HaGaon Rav Moshe Hillel Hirsch shlit"a, and the Sanz Rebbe shlit"a bless all donors to this urgent campaign that they should be spared worry, distress, and illness, merit children engaged in Torah, and enjoy lives filled with goodness and kindness.”

How can things like this be promised? Is religion like a traiding market? You give me this and I give u that?

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They don’t? They promise nothing, they say that they will daven for such brachos for those who contribute, but the ultimate decision is in Hashem’s hand. If there’s no schar or onesh and never any result to prayer, what’s the point?

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I think the issue that some feel is the very, very strong and specific assurances, for this specific act, as well as perhaps some of the gimmicky/”screaming” ad headlines, the comfort/tolerance level for such likely varying by time, place, group, and individual.

Yes, this was my point.

Also, if you can almost promise, if you do XY you get Z, than basically undermines the concept of free will.

Because if it is made so clear, that such Mizwos bring you a reward right away and on this world, then the Bechira would be gone.

I don’t see what the problem is with this statement. In fact, it affirms a few significant Jewish fundamentals:

  1. ‘אמונה בה
  2. ‘בטחון בה
  3. ‘אהבת ה
  4. Hashem is All-Knowing
  5. Hashem rewards and punishes
  6. בחירה חפשית
  7. ואהבת לרעך כמוך via believing in oneself

It kind of combines a few of the י’ג עקרים with concepts from שער הבטחון in חובות הלבבות.

Let’s not forget that the Christians did copy a few things from us :slightly_smiling_face:.

I agree that fictional stories shouldn’t be peddled around like non-fiction. However, a lot of Midrash Aggada stories also may not be all factual in a sense. Nonetheless, Chazal felt compelled to publicize them in order to teach us something.

These recently published exaggerated stories provide Chizzuk to a lot of people, so it may be worthwhile not to disregard them completely.

Chazal did not purport to be historical. These stories do. That is a vast and important difference which in the end makes the latter questionable and even destructive. Kinda (only kinda, but the analogy sprang to mind) like the girls at Gush Katif who were told their davening would reverse the Hitnatkut and ended up going off the derech.

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Is it true or not though? What mekoros support that statement? That’s my question

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Additionally…על הראשונים אנו מצטערים.

Attempting to understand אגדות חז”ל, un-weaponize them, and avoid the pitfalls that incorrect takes can cause, has been an almost permanent moment in Jewish history, from the Geonim, through Rambam (who literally sounds like he is describing the contemporary scene, in his הקדמה לפרק חלק!), Ramban, to RSRH and current thinkers (with the exception of those who don’t see the problem, and run headling into those very pitfalls).

Chazal, as an under-statement, are “worth the effort.” The guy who wants to publish his best-seller, tear-jerker, “incredible, amazing, beyond-belief” fictionalized hashgacha story today? Less than convinced.

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Building chizuk and emunah on exaggerations and falsehoods does not lead to lasting and true chizuk or emunah. To the contrary it is liable to destroy emunah when one is old enough to realize that he was sold lies. Our emunah is built on a father not lying to his child. Today most of these stories are easily fact checked, so the realization that many (if not most) stories are false or exaggerated comes faster for those who care to check. Sadly many of the publishers and promoters do not seem to care and will continue to peddle untruths even when they are fully aware of inaccuracies and problems with the stories. If us as frum parents and consumers won’t demand emes we end up with lots of bogus sheker. The Midrashim of chazal are clearly meant to educate and how to deal with Midrashim and Aggados is best understood through rishonim and achronim that deal with them.

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I’m not aware of any direct sources that discuss this specific statement, but its connotations run deep throughout our Mesorah.

Of course we shouldn’t be teaching Sheker and selling it as Emes, especially just to turn a profit. However, there’s a difference between outright Sheker vs. utilizing exaggeration to drive home a point.

My previous comment was meant to convey that not all these stories should be read through a black and white lens; there’s some gray to them that should be taken into consideration. As they say: “Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater”.

Exaggeration is a very slippery slope.

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Sadly I can provide you with many cases of outright sheker and gross distortions. There are no industry standards for what is printed or how it is vetted. When issues are raised with publishers, writers, and promoters the response is often indifference and continuing publications of untruths. I have dealt with publishers, authors and promoters, it is really bad.

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